SIZZLING!!! Transfer 20,000 Starwood Starpoints Into 33,750 AA Miles!!!

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Originally posted on 06/14:

Update 2-06/20: All Starpoints converted last week have just posted over to AA, along with all of the bonus miles!

Update: AA has just clarified and confirmed a number of parts of this promo: -As long as you initiate the transfer by 06/30 you will get the bonus points, regardless of when they arrive in your AA account.
-Individual transfers that result in less that 20,000 AA miles will only get a 25% bonus. Although the Terms And Conditions seems to imply that the lower 25% rate only applies for cumulative transfers of under 20,000 miles, (“convert points from eligible AAdvantage program hotel participants that result in 1,000 – 20,000 AAdvantage miles within the Promotion Period”) it has been clarified that only transactions that result in 20,001 or more miles individually will get the 35% bonus.
-If you transfer 20,000 Starpoints you will get the full 33,750 miles.
-You may convert from as many hotel chains as you want, but again, only 20,001+ mile transactions earn the 35% bonus.
-There is no limit to the amount of bonus miles you can earn (However Starwood does have a daily cap for mileage transfers, so don’t transfer more than 60,000 Starpoints per day if you want to maximize your mileage conversion)
-Starpoints transfer to AA miles every Monday and the 35% bonus will post shortly after that.
-The names on the Starwood account and the AA account must match or the transfer will be rejected. You are able to transfer Starpoints for free between people living at the same address.
-Transferred AA miles and the bonus will count towards million miler lifetime elite status.
-Points earned from hotel stays that go directly into your AA account, like Hyatt’s promo of 3,000 points per stay, do not qualify for the bonus. Only points that you transfer qualify.
-You are able to do a Starwood Nights and Flights redemption for 60,000 Starpoints in exchange for 67,500 AA miles and 5 nights in a category 3 property, or 70,000 Starpoints in exchange for 67,500 AA miles and 5 nights in a category 4 property. Those points are considered transferred points.
-All questions regarding this program should be directed to AAdvantage reps, not hotel reps, as the hotel programs have nothing to do with the 35% bonus.

SPG Mileage Transfer Page (limits stated on this page are daily mileage transfer limits)

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Also AA counts all miles earned towards million miler lifetime elite status!  So if you transfer 100,000 Starpoints into AA you will be 17% of the way towards lifetime million miler elite status besides for having 168,750 miles.  At 1 million miles you earn lifetime Gold status and at 2 million miles you earn lifetime Platinum status.  You also earn 8 500-mile upgrades (or 4 systemwide upgrades if you have an international address on your AA account) when you reach 1 million miles and you earn 4 more systemwide upgrades for every subsequent million miler level.

AA also has some great redemption options, like just 20,000 miles each way to Europe or South America during off-peak season.  They also have 2 award charts, the zone based partner award chart and the mileage based One World “Round-The World” award chart so you can see which chart will be more advantageous.

AA is part of the 11 members OneWorld alliance and is also partners with many other airlines, including El Al, Brussels, Gol Brasil, Hawaiian, Alaska, Air Tahiti Nui, and other.

-For every 20,000 Starpoints you transfer you normally get 25,000 AA miles. Remember to transfer in increments of 20,000 Starpoints to get the maximum mileage.

AA will add 35% to that, or 8,750 miles, for a total of 33,750 miles.  In effect you will get 1.6875 AA miles per Starpoint.

-To earn the 35% conversion bonus, you must convert points from eligible hotel participants that equate to 20,001 or more AAdvantage miles within the Promotion Period.

-Do not transfer more than 60,000 Starpoints per day to AA.

-The promo only runs for transfers initiated from 06/14 through 06/30.

-It can take between 1-10 days for Starpoints to reach your AA account. On average though it should take a week.

-The 35% bonus miles will post within 7 days of the miles posting to your AA account.

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147 Comments On "SIZZLING!!! Transfer 20,000 Starwood Starpoints Into 33,750 AA Miles!!!"

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which one is better this or transfer to ua for the 50% bonus.

i want to use my miles for a business class trip to europe. does it make sense ua more bec of star alliance nad one world doesnt have so many options? thank you


Thanks for this link, Im trying to transfer now, can you give intructions, do we need to transfer it first to a hotel or can i directly transfer starwood points? Do i need to transfer through a link or can i do it directly through starwood?


From terms and conditions “Bonus miles earned in this promotion do not count toward elite status qualification”


Here is the SPG transfer link. The limits stated on the transfer page are daily transfer limits.

That’s correct, they don’t count towards annual elite status, only flown miles count towards that.

However AA is the only airline that counts all miles, no matter what the source, towards million miler lifetime elite status.
Trust me, I’ve only flown maybe 25,000 miles on AA planes, but I have lifetime Platinum million miler elite status!


With the 35% bonus be added by AA automatically? Is there a link to the terms and conditions?


Just to be clear, there minimum transfer for the 35% bonus is 20,001?


The miles will be added by AA within 7 days, this info and the links can all be found in the post.

At least 20,000 miles need to hit your AA account during the promo to get the 35% bonus.
A single 20,000 Starpoint transfer will easily accomplish that.


The sreen diamond list doesnt specify Starwood, though it does list all starwood hotels. Should it say SPG or the fact that it says Sheraton, Westin,etc. is enough?


That’s because “Starwood” isn’t a hotel chain, it’s the managing group for Sheraton, Westin, W, Four Points, St. Regis, Le Meridian, Luxury Collection, etc, which are all on the list.
It also doesn’t list “Priority Club” although it lists all their hotels.

Nothing to worry about.


Thanks for the response Dan!

One more thing,would you recommend one transfer of 40,000 miles or two transfers of 20,000 each (or is there no difference)?



There’s no difference at all.


“you must convert points from eligible hotel participants that equate to 20,001 or more AAdvantage miles within the Promotion Period.” Can you explain? the spg points had to have been earned through hotel stays? does it work if the spg points are from opening the CC?


It doesn’t matter how you earn the SPG points. Transfer 20,000 Starpoints and you’ll have 33,750 AA miles within a couple weeks. It’s as simple as that.

Mordy L.

any way to transfer someone else’s starwood points into my aa account?


@Mordy L.:

You can only transfer from your Starwood account to your AA account.

However you can transfer Starpoints from someone else’s Starwood account to your Starwood account IF you have the same home address on your Starwood profiles on


which you do this or us airways

Mordy L.

so if the other person changes her profile to my address, i can transfer her points to me, and then do this deal?


How many AA miles do you need for Israel? Is it hard to find an award ticket to or from Israel? Direct or even with a stop over?


can I transfer 20000 starwood and 5000 priority club and receive the bonus on everything?


Can I transfer my Membership Rewards points to my SPG account and then transfer those points to my Advantage account? Does it make sense to do this?


I believe El Al has decent availability. The cost is 45,000 miles each way. It’s actually much better to use AA miles than El Al points because El Al charges a very hefty fuel surcharge for using their own points, but AA doesn’t charge the fuel surcharge, even when redeeming for travel on El Al.

Or you can go off-peak via europe for 40,000 miles each way.


60,000 AMEX will become 20,000 Starpoints which will become 33,750 AA.


Is the only way to book award travel through calling them up?


From or to Israel?


AA award travel can be booked online. Otherwise you need to call.

Same rate.


I’m short four thousand starpoints (i have about 16,000) is it worth it to buy the last four thousand and transfer them over?


That would depend on what you’re paying to buy them.


Sorry dont understand If I would like to book a ticket with ELAL do I need to call?

Yaakov S

Can I buy Starpoints from someone to transfer for me to my AA account? I saw above the address needs to be the same, but that’s it? If they change their address or I change mine it works?


I tried looking for an itiniary to Europe via the AA Advantage website. It says that AA doesn’t fly this route but call tem to check their parters. Is there a website to check all possible flight using the AA partners, similar to ANA for Star Aliance?


When you say 1 million miles earned gets you lifetime gold, do they need to be earned or accrued the same year? Or is it 1 million miles total earned from when i joined the program?


Wow! Looks like for transfers of 1000-20000 you still get a 25% bonus. I participated in Hyatt’s 25K AA mile promo and 3 stays and the final bonus (3500×3 plus 10000) will post in the next few weeks. So, assuming they get credited correctly, for 6 Hyatt stays I’ll be earning 3 free nights, Diamond amentity points for each stay and at least 32625 AA miles. Not bad.



Qantas, but it’s not perfect.

1 million lifetime from when you joined the program.
Go here and look under “Program to date miles” to check your status:

Hotel stays do not count according to the T’s and C’s, only hotel point transfer count.


Do you have to sign up/register for this promo or will it take effect if you just transfer normally?


It’s automatic for transfers initiated 06/14-06/30.


so this would raise the 10 – 2 priority club transfer rate also


Yes, it would be 10,000 priority club=2,700 AA assuming you also do a 20K SPG transfer. In other words you can “buy” AA miles for 2.22 cents each by buying Priority Club for 0.6 cents each. If you buy 120,000 Priority Club at .6 cents that would cost $720 and net you 32,400 AA miles.

Although you’d still be better off buying Starwood at 3 cents and transferring to AA. Buying 20K SPG at 3 cents for $600 would net 33,750 AA or 1.77 cents each.

question to the man dan

is this an awesome deal or just good??


@question to the man dan:
This is an excellent deal.

So is anyone going to hit million miler lifetime elite status with this promo?

s wei

yes i will hit it whats better 8 500 mile upgrades or the 4 other should i switch my address


I have 50k hilton points can those be transferred to AA with this program


how do you buy starwood points for 3 cents? on the website its advertised as 3.5 cents?


i dont see how this deal is sizzling, one normally gets 25000 points for a transfer of 20k spg points. and AA isnt a great airline, and its not part of the star alliance, personally i think 20000 spg points is worth more then 33750 AA points. Dan if you think i am way off base here please explain why.


why only do 60k miles at one time?


i did 60004 is that bad?


which deal is better us airway or aa


US Airways had a MASSIVE response to its promo (from people who opened up accounts, never flew with them, and just bought or transferred miles) and has been going nuts with fraud investigations and freezing people’s accounts without just cause. While 50%>35% I wouldn’t chance it with US Scareways


@s wei:
4 systemwide upgrades are better.

50,000 Hilton normally becomes 7,500 AA.
With this promo it would become 10,125 AA if you transfer at least 20,000 AA miles during the promo period.

Send me an email and I may be able to point you in the right direction.

AA has incredible award availability, is partners with El Al, the OneWorld alliance is still very good, they have excellent off-peak award pricing, and these miles count towards million miler.
Seems hot to me.

60,0004 is fine. 80,000 in a day though would be rejected so 60,000 is the highest to do while aiming for 20K increments.


Is there any way to look up one’s current lifetime mileage on the AA website?


Scratch that – I see it now, it’s shown as “program to date” mileage


Thanks for the link. I just transfered 60,000 starwood points to AA!


Enjoy the 101K AA miles!


I have 160,000 Hilton points, now that they devalued by their recent changes, is the best I can do with them? or are there sometimes betters transfer offers? (in general what can I do with these Hilton points?)

Thanks a lot!


@Mendel: for all miscellaneous questions.


Hi Dan,

I want to buy some Starwood points, can you help out?


Dan a few people asked the same think, but no answer, is AA better or US?


1. Take out the general question, is this a good deal for Hilton points?
2. Is there a thread for this already started?


Can someone please answer. What is better the AA deal or the US air deal?


Its a good deal, but not for everyone. For example, 20k Starwood points converted to LAN will yield 3 round-trips YYZ-LGA on AA if converted to LAN. (20k Starwood = 50k LAN. YYZ-LGA costs 16k LAN Kms when redeemed on AA).

Transferring the same 20k to AA using the promo will not even yield enough for one round-trip.


Yes, AA miles are generally worth much more than US miles.
Plus US is closer to bankruptcy than AA is.

No, I don’t think that’s a good use of Hilton points.

Why would 33,750 AA miles not be enough to go from YYZ-LGA?
Yes, LAN can be worth more in limited scenarios, namely very short-haul nonstop flights in coach. However besides for that AA is far superior.
US-Europe/South America for 40K AA round-trip off-peak (usually with excellent availability) is amazing. As is US-Asia for 50K.

Also AA has reduced mileage awards for 7,500 less miles with their credit card.


Edit to the above.

Transferring the same 20k to AA using the promo will not even yield enough for two round trips.


do aa miles expire?


“US-Europe/South America for 40K AA round-trip off-peak (usually with excellent availability) is amazing. As is US-Asia for 50K.”

I thought it was 40k miles ONE way???


AA miles don’t expire as long as you have activity in the account every 18 months.
Starpoints don’t expire as long as you have activity in the account every 12 months.

You thought wrong, those are round-trip rates.

s wei

thanks for the answer on those upgrades.what about marriott or priority points are they worth transfering?


Dan, I have 827,640 program to date miles. I don’t have any other miles or points. If I am to get them from somewhere else, what would be the best option for me to get that will work best?
Also, I just hit my mileage cap on my aadvantage credit card. Once I reach a million miles, will my cap be removed? If yes, I just realized I reached my cap today, while the past month I spent about 30k. Do you think I’ll be able to have the cap lifted retroactively so i’ll get those miles?
Thanks for all your superb work!


is it worth transferring delta miles to aa ? Is it part of the promo ? will they charge for it ?


Unless you NEED AA miles (esp. to bump up Lifetime miles to reach 1M or 2M thresholds) I don’t find this deal particularly “sizzling”. Personally, I’d rather keep my Starwood points. Thanks for keeping us on top of all the deals out there… you’ve got me checking your site all day long.


I have 51k hilton. What do you think is better keep them or transfer them into approx 10k AA miles with this offer?


You definitely should transfer enough Starpoints to hit 1 million miles.
AA is the only airline that counts miles earned from any source towards million miler and they can end that at any time.
If you don’t have them then buy them!

When you hit 1 million the earning cap will be lifted from your AAdvantage credit card, but not retroactively.

Starwood Starpoints or AMEX Membership Rewards points can be transferred into different mileage programs at great ratios.
Miles can’t be transferred.

Fair enough.
The reason it’s sizzling is because AA miles can be worth up to 2 cents each, so as long as you can get Starpoints for under 3.4 cents each you will have a lower cost per AA mile than 2 cents.
Plus million miler with 4 international upgrades is awesome.

I’d keep the hilton.


Members cannot combine AAdvantage mileage conversions from the same or multiple eligible AAdvantage program hotel participants to earn the bonus miles.


dan how would you say aa is with award travel to europe?not just how many miles but what other airlines can you fly on and is it much worse than star alliance where you have tons of airlines to fly.

i reallly apreciate all your advice


71 Responses to “SIZZLING!!! Transfer 20,000 Starwood Starpoints Into 33,750 AA Miles!!!”

Help! I called Starwood to teransfer the 20,000 miles, but they had no record of the promotion and said I would only get 5,000 extra. Anyone know how to do this???


thanks for the post! If I dont fly with in the next 18 months I will loose my points. I will prob use a hotel room in the next 18 months though, so how do the points compare when getting a free room from spg vs AA? Is it worth it to switch over the miles if im not for sure flying? Thank you!


I have 4 system wide upgrades, and have lost many to expiration. What is the value, if any for them? I almost never purchase tickets, as I usually fly with miles. If I am allredy platinum for life, would you transfer 200k points from starwood, just to hit the next million? (new luggage tags, 4 more upgrades)


Continental, USAir, and United are all very stingy with award availability, which is why their miles are only valuable because they are part of the Star Alliance.

AA is very generous with award availability so the alliance isn’t as critical. And they also have over 20 partners:

This has nothing to do with Starwood.
AA will add 35% to your mileage transfer automatically on their end.

Will you rent a car in the next 18 months? That’s enough to extend your AA account for 18 more months.
Or you can even purchase a magazine for a couple hundred miles to extend your account.

They are very valuable, especially for long routes such as flights to Asia, India, South America, or even Europe.
They confirm you from any coach fare into business class or from business class to first.
And they are transferable, so you can upgrade someone else’s itinerary.


Could I transfer 40,000 miles at once, or do I need to transfer 2 x 20,000 points, in order to get the 5,000 bonus per 20,000?


You can transfer 40,000 at once without any problem.


thanks for your help. so are you doing this deal or sitting it out? also when i look for flights to europe they only have availablity with aa and not let say with british. is aa much worse then let say with swiss or lufthansa . which has availablity for my dates .talking about business class


i don’t see the big deal about being lifetime gold, the old benefits are not that great



-4 systemwide upgrades (with international address)
-Exit rows
-No baggage fees for you or companions
-No limit on Citi AA card
-25% bonus miles
-OneWorld Ruby Status
-500 mile minimum elite+redeemable miles on all segments
-Priority checkin, security, and boarding.
-Free standby
-Elite priority phone number

And only another million to go until lifetime Platinum and 4 more systemwide upgrades.


i want to fly to Australia i have 250k in starwood. how much is a mileage ticket with aa or a partner?


37,500 miles for a one-way between the US and Australia in coach.
See the links in the post for AA mileage ticket rates.


Dan, I transfered allmy starwood points to AA. Now, I have chase saphire points whoch can be transferred to mariot points. would I then be able to transfer them to AA and get the bonus?


dan is there a limit to how meny you can transfer in total ?



You can probably do better by trading the Sapphire points to someone who wants Continental and getting AA miles via Starpoints in return.



I need help my grandfather was just niftar need to get to ny from tlv for shloshim wich is july 12 the tix are 1030 with a stopover i have 40,000 starpoints what is the best way for me to get there as cheap as possible…im so bad with all these points,miles things! thanks so much!


dan i have 44898 points in my spg acct. is it a good deal to make a transfer and have it in aa? I only use it for tickets to israel so basically the question is where is it better to bank it. does the bonus make it worth banking in aa? I have 18768 aa miles now and every month i add about 1000 (credit card)
thanx for the help


I would love to transfer amex points to aa miles. can i transfer amex points to a hotel chain at 1:1 and transfer to aa and get 35% bonus?


help please
hi dan i already have aa gold staus and i transfered 80,000
miles from spg account to my wifes aa account and you say it has to go from the same name spg account to the same name aa account.
how do i fix that


No, you’ll lose most of the miles in that process. You’re best bet is to try to trade with someone else.

Try calling Starwood to cancel the transfer.


thanks dan
tell everyone to fix similar problem i had just to call SPG and they canceled transfer and move points to the right account and then i went into spg and redid the transfer to AA. all in 10 minutes time
thanks for your help you are just A W E S O M E


dan please answer my post


if i have membership points is there anyway for me to maneuver it into a hotel program and then to AA advantage at a rate that its worth it.
and which hotel program would be the best one?


anyone have any info for me…how many points is it from tlv to ewr of jfk?


sara with continental the amount depends on the date of travel. if you go on their web site and click reward travel travel it will tell you if and how much it is


thanks it says 70,000 points- how many spg points would that be?


Do you think there is a chance that American will not offer the lifetime platinum in the future. I don’t have even close to 1 million miles. If i cash in all my hotel points, spg, Marriott, and pc, ill have around 400-500k.
is it still a good idea?



your right. Im probably best off switching the points for cash


continental transfers 2:1 so not a very good option at all


You write about signing up for the Starwoods Amex: ” Earn 10,000 Starpoints With First Purchase, and 30,000 more Starpoints with your first $15,000 in purchases.” Their site is showing that you can earn only 15,000 more point with the $15,000 in purchases. Which one is correct?



The 30,000 points represents the basic 15,000 points from $15,000 in purchases PLUS the “bonus” 15,000 points.


its a total of 30,000 for the 15,000 spent plus 15,000 bonus for a total of 30,000


hi dan i have 850,000 aa points and my brotherinlaw has about 120,000 sp. can i transfer it from his sp to my aa if yes how?

thanks for your fantastic work


Dan – You made one mistake – EVIP’s are not upgradable from any fare internationally. They have the be in most classes but not the Cheap sale fares and low dicount webfares. That being said you would prob put a ticket on hold, call the rep to ask if it elegible and if not they can up the class at the next cheapest price.


my wife’s aa account is in her married name and her SPG account is in her maiden name. Although the transfer is generally rejected when the names don’t match I was informed by an aa agent that if SPG writes the name that aa has on file on the transfer then it won’t be a problem. I’ll keep you posted.


Your welcome!

Not at a good rate unless you find someone else to trade with.

If the addresses on the profiles match you can.

I believe that AA started allowing EVip systemwide upgrades on all fares last year.



Dan, I believe the cost of starpoints has gone up to 0.35 cents a point…


how much will i get if i transfer 30.000 points?


Yes, but you shouldn’t have a problem finding a way to buy a 3 cents a piece.

You only get the 5,000 mile bonus on Starpoint transfers in increments of 20,000.
So for 30,000 SPG you’ll get 30,000+5,000=35,000×1.35=47,250 AA


Sorry to be repetitive here Dan, I’m a little mixed up…
What would be the math if I transfer 9600 points?


Not very good.
9,600 Starpoints x1.25 = 12,000 miles.
Whereas 20,000 Starpoints=25,000 x1.35 = 33,750 miles.


How many miles can I get if I transfer 15000 PriorityClub points?


Anyone know where i can buy starwood points for 2 cents, or the like, it seems like that is what they are worth… or if anyone is interested in selling them please let me know.


Nowwhere now. The price of a Starpoint skyrocketed since this promotion because even at 3 cents a piece it’s like buying AA miles at 1.78 cents which is roughly their going rate and plus they qualify for million miler with systemwide upgrades.


where can you get them at 3 cents a piece?


There are places, email me and I’ll try to point you the right way.


I would like to transfer my 600k spg to AA to get the “million miler”. Prob is AA shut me down 5 years ago for selling miles. Do you think opening new account at new address will work? THANKS


I just transfered 80000 starpoints to AA, But now I see that I can get 3 cents a point is there any way to stop the transfer changing names on my AA acount or any other way? thanks


I have AMEX Business GOLD = does it make sense for me to switch to starwood and will i be able to transfer the miles I already have? thanks dan! You are awesome!!


try calling starwoods that might cancel the transfer if it did not actualy transfern yet


are mileage tickets usually cheaper then regular tickets ?


How do I merge my membership rewards account with my SPG account? I called SPG and they knew nothing about it.


i transferred 40000 starwood points from my mother’s account into my aa account,and i don’t have a starwood account yet, although we have dif. names, it all transferred along with the bonus!


You cant merger MR with SPG .All u can do is transfer MR points to SPG at a ration of 3:1 .

Menachem Mendel

I currently have 67.147 starwood points, is it worth it to transfer all of them in AA? or transfer 60.000 and wait till I get another 20.000?
I wont be hitting 20.000 by June 30th.


Hey Dan thanks for the tip! I just earned 34,000 miles!! I was waiting for the right time to transfer them over and Im so glad I did then! Thanks again!


I just got my spg miles transferred to AA but there was no 35% bonus!! What do I do? Does it come later?


That’s just how it posted this week, don’t worry about it.
Give it another week to post.


sorry im a lil confused but if i transfer 20000 will i get the ful bonus or do i need 20001??



Yes, you will get 33,750 miles if you transfer 20,000 Starpoints.



how do i get the 5000 bonus? will i aslo get that if i transfer 20000?



I want to transfer my miles from SPG, but my SPG account has my maiden name, and AA has my married name. I called and they said it wont go through. If I apply for the name change it can take quite a few days? What will happen if I put in the paperwork tomorrow to change my name, and also transfer the miles tomorrow because the deal is ending?


Again, if you transfer 20K Starwood you will get 33,750 AA.

Open a new SPG account under your new name at the same address as your current account, call up SPG to transfer the points from your old account to your new account, and then make the transfer to AA.


if im looking to sell my starpoints is it worth it for me to transfer to aa and sell those instead?


I did the 40,000 (50,000) transfer over a week ago, and the bonus posted the same day as the 50,000 miles.

My wife did the transfer last week (from her SPG to her AA) and the 50,000 posted on 6/25 but the bonus did not post.

Should we be concerned?


No, see here: @Dan/Ctownbochur:


Thank u so much for that advice to make a new account under my married name-it worked like a charm! Im not sure if any one mentioned this but when i transferred 60,000 miles from spg, they rep told me it will go over as 75,000 because spg gives an extra 5,000 for every 20,000??? Is this true? does that mean im going to get %35 of 75,000? Thank u!!!


No problem, glad I can help out!

The ratio of 20,000:33,750 already includes the 35% bonus on the 25,000.


Thank u so much for that advice to make a new account under my married name-it worked like a charm!! just transferred 60,000!


Transferred over 2 weeks ago. Bonus did not post yet??????????????????


Transferred 40k June 29 & 28k June 30th. I only received the 5,000 for each 20,000.
I did not receive the additional points.


I transferred 40000 points too, and only got the 5000 points bonus


Another Monday has passed. No premium bonus yet!!!




The additional bonus was in the account as of today.


Can one transfer AA points to someone elses AA Acount?


-The names on the Starwood account and the AA account must match or the transfer will be rejected. You are able to transfer Starpoints for free between people living at the same address.